Moderator: Community Manager
[Post Reply] [*]  Page 2 of 2  [ 17 posts ]  Go to page « 1 2
Author Message
acelanceloet
Post subject: Re: Canada's Cold War Cadillacs - Destroyer Escorts of the RCNPosted: October 21st, 2022, 4:51 pm
Offline
User avatar
Posts: 7510
Joined: July 28th, 2010, 12:25 pm
Location: the netherlands
Well, how did you define what was shaded and what was not? Did you use an angle or anything like that as definition?

_________________
Drawings are credited with J.Scholtens
I ask of you to prove me wrong. Not say I am wrong, but prove it, because then I will have learned something new.
Shipbucket Wiki admin


Top
[Profile] [Quote]
Rainmaker
Post subject: Re: Canada's Cold War Cadillacs - Destroyer Escorts of the RCNPosted: October 21st, 2022, 7:45 pm
Offline
Posts: 247
Joined: August 2nd, 2010, 6:12 pm
Location: Montreal, QC
acelanceloet wrote: *
Well, how did you define what was shaded and what was not? Did you use an angle or anything like that as definition?
Well, for the underwater hull, I attempted to use the 45 degrees rule for the shading - the hull does taper quite sharply as it moves toward the bow, as you can see in the photos. To me, it seems nearly vertical about halfway between the gun mount and the bow, so perhaps I should move the shaded area forward somewhat?

For the top of the hull with the rounded edge, I tried to eyeball how much of the hull would be shaded with sunlight coming from the top right. This kind of quickly illustrates what I was thinking as far as shading, but I'm open to input as far as modifying it.

[ img ]

Thanks again for the feedback - it's much appreciated!


Top
[Profile] [Quote]
acelanceloet
Post subject: Re: Canada's Cold War Cadillacs - Destroyer Escorts of the RCNPosted: October 22nd, 2022, 9:41 am
Offline
User avatar
Posts: 7510
Joined: July 28th, 2010, 12:25 pm
Location: the netherlands
Well, the one important thing with shading is to be consistent. So if you used 45 degree shading on the underwater hull, why use something else on the hull above the water?

I would personally do something like this (I did not thoroughly measure anything or draw cross sections to get it exactly right so check before using)
[ img ]
The changes I made:
- skeg and rudder are near vertical so are coloured in the base shade
- forwards of the bilge keel, the hull gets rounder first, then goes to triangular and the angle of that triangle gets nearer to vertical so the shading goes to near zero, only the rounded part at the bottom
- above the water, the waterline does not cross 45 degrees so none of the hull is shaded.

Note how all shading edges are near horizontal. The more abrubt the edge of a shaded area changes in height, the greater the change in shape the hull has. A very streamlined ship has very gradual changes in shape, note for example my CGN-9 http://www.shipbucket.com/drawings/8301/file

_________________
Drawings are credited with J.Scholtens
I ask of you to prove me wrong. Not say I am wrong, but prove it, because then I will have learned something new.
Shipbucket Wiki admin


Top
[Profile] [Quote]
eswube
Post subject: Re: Canada's Cold War Cadillacs - Destroyer Escorts of the RCNPosted: October 23rd, 2022, 7:55 am
Offline
Posts: 10696
Joined: June 15th, 2011, 8:31 am
Good work, but I'm with Ace on the shading (although when it comes to "the darkest shadow shade used to demarcate angular breaks in the superstructure less than 90 degrees in angle" I prefer to use a much, much darker shade, to make this break much more prominent).


Top
[Profile] [Quote]
Rainmaker
Post subject: Re: Canada's Cold War Cadillacs - Destroyer Escorts of the RCNPosted: January 8th, 2024, 6:44 pm
Offline
Posts: 247
Joined: August 2nd, 2010, 6:12 pm
Location: Montreal, QC
Continuing on with this project, slowly but surely! We're getting close to the end now.

Part Three: Mackenzie - class Destroyer Escorts

The initial design for what became known as the Mackenzie - class was for an enlarged version of the St. Laurent - class destroyer escorts. Designed in 1957, they were to be 1,000 tonnes (980 long tons) heavier, 50 feet (15 m) longer and have engines that were 20,000 horsepower (15,000 kW) stronger than those installed in the St. Laurents. They would also have improved radar and sonar installed; surface-to-air missile systems such as the American Tartar system were also considered during this time period. Instead, budget issues forced a repeat of the previous Restigouche - class, with changes intentionally minimized. Like their predecessors, they were named for Canadian rivers.

Four ships were ordered in 1957, and two more in 1958, although the the design of the final two ships of the class was modified in 1959 to incorporate the changes made to the St. Laurent - class. These two ships then became a separate class, known as the Annapolis - class. The remaining four Mackenzies were essentially improved Restigouches, with improved habitability and better pre-wetting, bridge and weatherdeck fittings to better deal with extreme cold. The aft deckhouse was closer to the original design of the St. Laurent - class, with Mk IV torpedo throwers initially being fitted.

[ img ]

The lead ship of the class, HMCS Mackenzie was ordered in 1957 and was laid down on 15 December 1958 at Canadian Vickers Ltd., Montreal. The ship was launched on 25 May 1961 and was commissioned into the RCN on 6 October 1962 with the classification number DDE 261

Although she was initially assigned to the Atlantic Fleet based at Halifax, Mackenzie was transferred to the Pacific on 2 March 1963. She was assigned to the Pacific Fleet as a member of the Fourth Canadian Destroyer Squadron along with her three sister ships of the Mackenzie - class, and spent the majority of her serving as a training ship with the RCN and later in the Canadian Forces under Maritime Forces Pacific as part of Training Group Pacific.

[ img ]

HMCS Qu'Appelle, seen here, was unique in her class, in that the Vickers 3-inch/70 caliber main gun was unavailable when Qu'Appelle was being constructed as only a limited number of the guns had been manufactured before production ceased, and instead the American 3-inch/50 caliber Mk 33 gun was installed in the forward mount.

As early as 1961 with the Brock Report, it was intended that all four Mackenzies would receive a refit similar to the IRE refit applied to the Restigouches, which would have seen them fitted with the ASROC weapons system. Unfortunately, budget cuts resulted in only four the Restigouches being converted to ASROC carriers and none of the Mackenzies receiving the conversion. By the early 1970s, the Mackenzies had received a limited refit in lieu of the ASROC conversion, replacing the Mk IV torpedo throwers with Mk 32 triple torpedo tubes along with the American Mk 46 homing torpedo. The WLR-1C electronic countermeasures system was also fitted during this time period, mounted on pole masts on the aft part of the main superstructure.

[ img ]

In the early to mid-1980s, the Mackenzies received DEstroyer Life EXtension (DELEX) refit, which was born out of the need to extend the life of the steam-powered destroyer escorts of the Canadian Navy until the next generation of surface ship was built. Encompassing all the classes based on the initial St. Laurent (the remaining St. Laurent, Restigouche, Mackenzie, and Annapolis-class vessels), the DELEX upgrades were meant to improve their ability to combat modern Soviet submarines, and to allow them to continue to operate as part of NATO task forces. All of the ships in the class had their refits performed at Esquimalt, British Columbia.

The DELEX refit for the Mackenzie - class was similar to that of the Improved Restigouche-class vessels. This meant that the ships would receive the new tactical data system ADLIPS (Automatic Data Link Plotting System), new navigation radars, new fire control and satellite navigation. They exchanged the hull-mounted SQS-503 sonar for the newer SQS-505 model, although the Mackenzies never received a variable depth sonar, limiting their capabilities. Modifications were also made to the SPS-12 air search radar.

All four Mackenzie - class destroyer escorts were paid off between 1992 and 1994, having had relatively uneventful careers. Their lack of modern anti-submarine equipment such as variable-depth sonar, helicopters, or stand-off weapons like ASROC meant that they were largely relegated to the training role. They were replaced in service by the Halifax - class frigates. HMCS Mackenzie, HMCS Saskatchewan, and HMCS Yukon were all scuttled as artificial reefs, while HMS Qu'Appelle was sold to a Chinese firm for scrapping in 1994.


Top
[Profile] [Quote]
Hood
Post subject: Re: Canada's Cold War Cadillacs - Destroyer Escorts of the RCNPosted: January 13th, 2024, 9:25 am
Offline
Posts: 7233
Joined: July 31st, 2010, 10:07 am
Excellent additions, it is certainly a shame that the Mackenzies didn't get the refits planned for them.

_________________
Hood's Worklist
English Electric Canberra FD
Interwar RN Capital Ships
Super-Darings
Never-Were British Aircraft


Top
[Profile] [Quote]
eswube
Post subject: Re: Canada's Cold War Cadillacs - Destroyer Escorts of the RCNPosted: January 26th, 2024, 10:57 pm
Offline
Posts: 10696
Joined: June 15th, 2011, 8:31 am
Very nice additions.


Top
[Profile] [Quote]
Display: Sort by: Direction:
[Post Reply]  Page 2 of 2  [ 17 posts ]  Return to “Real Designs” | Go to page « 1 2

Jump to: 

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 8 guests


The team | Delete all board cookies | All times are UTC


Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Limited
[ GZIP: Off ]