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Garlicdesign
Post subject: Re: Thiaria: Other People's shipsPosted: February 22nd, 2015, 9:13 pm
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Hello

Thanks for the praise everyone... I just went through my old pencil drawings. Some more surprises lurking there, I'm afraid.

@KHT: Did I say L/50 :oops: ? Of course I meant L/25, edited, thanks. And yes, there's more Thiarian ships to come, and the complete alternate WWII in the South Atlantic. Sooner or later...

Greetings
GD


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Krakatoa
Post subject: Re: Thiaria: Other People's shipsPosted: February 22nd, 2015, 9:58 pm
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Those are excellent looking ships GD.

Is the Riachuelo built to the design of the 19-teens for Brazil? (The real never were design)


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emperor_andreas
Post subject: Re: Thiaria: Other People's shipsPosted: February 23rd, 2015, 12:18 pm
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VERY nice work...LOVE the WWII design!

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eswube
Post subject: Re: Thiaria: Other People's shipsPosted: February 23rd, 2015, 6:20 pm
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Excellent work and backstory.


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Garlicdesign
Post subject: Re: Thiaria: Other People's shipsPosted: February 23rd, 2015, 7:36 pm
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Hello again
Krakatoa wrote:
Those are excellent looking ships GD.

Is the Riachuelo built to the design of the 19-teens for Brazil? (The real never were design)
The drawing is in fact based upon a very sketchy drawing of Breyer's, which is however so crude it had to be spiced up with details (mostly from the Queen Elizabeth) to look like a real ship. What makes things worse is the sad fact that I failed to find out on the net how long the ship is supposed to be; I scaled her so the turrets were the same size as those from the parts sheet, and ended up with a LoA of 206m, which felt just right. Might be wrong, however, that's why I did not post her as a real world never-were.

Greetings
GD


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waritem
Post subject: Re: Thiaria: Other People's shipsPosted: February 23rd, 2015, 9:36 pm
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Garlicdesign wrote:
the small Thiarian battleship Artacain steamed up and fired over 400 340mm shells into the port
GD
Did it have something to do with the WW1 area battlecruiser that was supposed to be finally declared obsolete in 1917 according to your thiarian history?

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Hood
Post subject: Re: Thiaria: Other People's shipsPosted: February 24th, 2015, 8:48 am
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Another superb design, the ship looks quintessentially British and you've done a great job. The US rebuild is a very neat idea too and its nice to contrast the styles in the same ship.

I'm sure there is a length for the real never-were in Conways. I'll have to check.

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bezobrazov
Post subject: Re: Thiaria: Other People's shipsPosted: February 24th, 2015, 11:28 pm
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These are unsurpassed what regards any AU, mine and all others included! Congratulation, GD, you put us handsomely to shame, and I am just happy about that!

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Garlicdesign
Post subject: Re: Thiaria: Other People's shipsPosted: March 9th, 2015, 9:32 pm
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Hello again!

After Chile ordered two superdreadnoughts with 10 356mm guns each in 1911, the Argentinians had to face the prospect that their US built dreadnoughts, which were not even delivered, would be outmatched within one or two years. As only one of the Chilean ships was laid down in 1911 due to financial problems, the problem was none too urgent at first, because the Argentines could confidently assume that Rivadavia and Moreno could handle the single Chilean ship. American, British, German, Italian and Thiarian yards were consulted for a follow-up design should the need become urgent, but due to the careless handling of confidential design informations during the tender for the Rivadavia-Class, the Germans, British and Americans were reluctant to provide high-end plans. The Italian Orlando Yard however prepared an upscale of the current Italian Andrea Doria class with eight 381mm guns in three twin and two superfiring single turrets and submitted them in 1912; an alternative design placed all guns in twin superfiring turrets fore and aft, with the space amidships formerly taken up by the fifth turret by more powerful machinery for a speed of 23 rather than previously 21 knots and more range. The ship was 185 meters long and much better protected than other contemporary Italian battleships, with a 300mm belt, 100mm horizontal protection on two decks and a full length torpedo bulkhead. Unusually for her time, the ship lacked torpedo tubes. It was the only fully worked out design available when the Chileans could finally fund laying down their second ship early in 1913, and the Argentinians needed only a few weeks to answer this move by placing an order at Orlando's in June 1913. The Italians had just finished building a slipway capable of 20.000 tons launch weight and had always had a reputation to build fast. They lived up to it by starting construction in September 1913 getting the ship ready to launch within 20 months by mid-May 1915. The Ship was named ARA Independencia. The heavy artillery was to be procured in Great Britain; the 16 152mm guns were to be of US make, the same ones as used on the Rivadavia class. The main armour was also to be supplied by Bethlehem Steel. Due to the war, neither artillery nor armour were delivered; the Independencia was laid up nearly immediately after launch, and no further work on her was done for the rest of the war. When it was over in 1918, the Italians informed the Argentinians that the building contract needed to be re-negotiated and the ship's price adjusted for Inflation; the new figure was so outrageous that the Argentinians cancelled the order and demanded repayment of the initial rates, which the Italians ignored. As it was clear that the Francesco Caracciolo-class battleships under construction for the Italian navy would not be completed for lack of funds, the hull of the Independencia was Italy's best chance to get at least one superdreadnought at an affordable price. There were enough guns and armour plate stockpiled for the Caracciolos, and the Independencia was renamed Francesco Morosini (a 17th century Venetian naval hero who spent - and lost - his life fighting the Turks; the name was originally assigned to one of the cancelled Caracciolos) and taken in hand for completion. When the Washington Naval Treaty was negotiated, the Morosini was 90% complete, and the Italians obtained the right to finish her, just as the US and Japan were allowed to complete West Virginia and Mutsu. She was commissioned on December 3rd, 1922; at that time, she looked like this:
[ img ]

During the 1920s, the Francesco Morosini served as the flagship of the Italian Navy. Late in the decade, the Italians were considering the replacement of their entire battleship inventory with newly built ships, save only the Morosini, who was to be retained at any rate. Consequently, she was the first Italian battleship to be modernized. The rebuild lasted from 1930 through 1933 and mainly aimed at increasing speed to 28 knots by installing a 95.000hp twin shaft powerplant and lenghtening her hull by 10 meters. The entire superstructure was removed in the process and replaced with a new one resembling contemporary heavy cruisers; the bow received a clipper shape, similar to the projected 1928 battlecruisers and the 1930s light cruiser designs. Unlike later rebuilds, the secondary casemates were retained, but a strong heavy AA battery of 16 100mm guns was added. A fixed catapult firing forward over the bow was planned, but never installed. When she re-emerged from her reconstruction, Francesco Morosini looked like this:
[ img ]

She again assumed her role as flagship of the Italian Navy and represented her country at the 1936 coronation review off Spithead; she also visited the USA, Germany, Russia, Brazil and Thiaria (Argentina was avoided). In 1938, the aftermost 100mm twin turrets and the two most forward 152mm guns on either side were landed and a total of 12 37mm/54 autocannons were installed. During the second world war, Francesco Morosini was among the most active heavy units of the Regia Marina and certainly the most successful; she actually was the only Italian battleship whose gunners managed to hit something. She was not at Taranto when the British struck the port and took part in the Battle of Matapan; she fired much more precisely as the new Vittorio Veneto and hit the British cruiser Gloucester with five 381mm and nineteen 152mm shells, sinking her. She then attempted to tow the crippled Pola to safety, but had to break the cable and take heel at 28 knots when three British battleships approached and destroyed two accompanying Italian heavy cruisers. She fired over 200 rounds in the general direction of the British without hitting anything due to the lack of radar. HMS Valiant put four and HMS Warspite three rounds into her, which laid waste to her superstructure and disabled one turret, but created no flooding and left the engines intact, enabling her to use her speed advantage to escape. After repairs - she received eight more 37mm guns and 24 20mm autocannons - Francesco Morosini repeatedly sortied against British convoys headed for Malta. During the intercept of Operation Vigourous, Francesco Morosini engaged the Free Greek battleship Salamis of the distant cover group and scored six hits without being hit in return, forcing her to retreat; this engagement however took so much time that she failed to engage the convoy proper. During the attacks on Operation Pedestal, the Francesco Morosini fought a long-range artillery duel with HMS Nelson and scored three hits; her CO however disengaged as soon as Nelson had scored her first hit, blowing the main artillery director overboard. During the repairs the Francesco Morosini received a radar set. When she was operational again in December 1942, she had just missed the invasion of Malta, but immediately was thrown against the allied forces invading French North Africa. She supported General Messe's armoured thrust through Algeria during 1943 with several shore bombardments; in August 1943 she took part in a night attack against allied forces bombarding axis positions at Oran and sank the monitor HMS Erebus in the first successful radar-guided night gunnery action of the Italian navy. She was torpedoed by HM submarine Umpire in September and barely made it home for repairs; after re-commissioning, she was immobilized due to lack of fuel oil. She was in La Spezia when Italy surrendered and taken over by the RSI; she was the only operational battleship remaining to Mussolini. During 1944, she was a premium target for allied Air attacks; her crew also thwarted a British attempt to sink her with a midget submarine. Despite many efforts, she was still afloat on VE day and was transferred to the Soviet Union in 1948. Under the name Novorossijsk, she served in the Black Sea Fleet till 1955, when she was sunk by a forgotten mine, declared a constructive total loss and scrapped. The picture shows her as she looked early in 1943 after repairing the damage suffered during Operation Pedestal:
[ img ]

Greetings
GD


Last edited by Garlicdesign on February 14th, 2017, 8:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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BB1987
Post subject: Re: Thiaria: Other People's shipsPosted: March 9th, 2015, 9:51 pm
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